Where to start?

[canes7]

I recently acquired a M1868 TD. This rifle was found with 2 others (M1866's) recently by a friend of mine. The 1868 Rifle is fairly straingt-forward and some good info out there about them. The 1868 I have has a dark finish on it that is neither bluing or parkerizing (thank God!). The M1866's are shorter than the rifle which leads me to believe they are either "Short Rifles" or "Cadet Rifles". The M1866's appear to have no finish and no serial numbers on them. The 1868 is in the 41k range and has "1870" stamped on the top of the receiver. I have never really been interested in weapons this old so I hope you guys do not mind if I ask a few noob type questions.

How would one differentiate a 1866 Cadet from a 1866 Short? I only looked over the M1866's for a few minutes and remember few details, but can get info. The 1866's are in Ohio, I am in NC so I'd have to relay info back and forth.

Are these rifles safe to shoot? I am sure that surplus ammo is not an option, is there any new production? These are .50 cal rifles. I know enough to know that they are .50-70 and not .50 BMG!

Thanks in advance for any info!

Dan

[free1954]

dick hosmer's website is a good place to start. http://www.picturetrail.com/sa4570af also he has written a book covering a lot of trapdoor history from that era
buffalo arms has loaded ammo http://www.picturetrail.com/sa4570af other places as well. if the rifles have been deemed safe to shoot'

[Dick Hosmer]

Well, I'm WAY behind on keeping up my website, and neither my 1866 Short Rifle, nor my 1867 Cadet has yet been posted. However, they are very easy to tell apart. The 1866 Short Rifle will have a full-thickness lockplate, dated 1862-1865 (MOST are 1863 or 1864) and the length of pull will be the same as the 1868, or any other standard arm of the period.

Actually, MOST shorter 1866s will prove to be Bannerman (etc.) cut-downs. Most have filled center band spring mortises, or have ugly-spaced bands. Their rods are usually flush with muzzle.

"Real" short rifles, which are pretty scarce, have the rod set back from the muzzle as on the full-length rifle, and have new stocks, cut for just two properly proportioned/spaced bands, with no filler patch.

The cadet will have a noticeably thinner lockplate, dated 1867 ONLY. And, the length of pull will be about 12.25", or around an inch shorter than normal. The whole arm is slimmer and lighter - it shoulders almost like a toy.

[JBinIll]

Are these rifles safe to shoot? I am sure that surplus ammo is not an option, is there any new production? These are .50 cal rifles. I know enough to know that they are .50-70 and not .50 BMG!

Thanks in advance for any info!

Dan

As with any firearm of this vintage an inspection of the rifle would be required as to shooting condition.New brass and reloading components along with suitable molds are available from places like Midway and Grafs.Black powder is the propellant to use given the inherrent weakness of the action design.Oversize bores are common or rather undersize molds as most new production molds cast a .512 dia.bullet and the bores on these usually require a .515.They are fun to shoot but are approaching the 150 years old mark.

[canes7]

Thanks for the responses! It is always interesting learning something new. Here are some pics of the 1868 Rifle. These rifles were found with a "tar" like coating on them. I had severly urged the finder not to clean them, but curiosity got the best of him. This is why the stock looks so dry. I haven't had a chance to get anything on the wood yet.

http://i239.photobucket.com/albums/ff207/hurricanes7/trapdoor/DSC01176.jpg

http://i239.photobucket.com/albums/ff207/hurricanes7/trapdoor/DSC01177.jpg

http://i239.photobucket.com/albums/ff207/hurricanes7/trapdoor/DSC01178.jpg

http://i239.photobucket.com/albums/ff207/hurricanes7/trapdoor/DSC01179.jpg

http://i239.photobucket.com/albums/ff207/hurricanes7/trapdoor/DSC01181.jpg

Thanks again!

Dan