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Thread: Load for my M14

  1. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by musculus View Post
    the M14 is NOT A "GARAND ACTION." While it is a gas ACTUATED rifle, like the Garand, the M14/M1A uses SELF REGULATED GAS SYSTEM. It will only take a specific amount of pressure than cuts itself OFF. Invented by Joseph C. White, not JCG.

    If the AMMO IS SAFE IN ANY RIFLE, it is SAFE in an M14/M1A.
    Do you speak from theory or practice? My personal experience is that hotter loads of IMR-4064 can and will bend an M14 operating rod. I don't doubt that the M14 is more tolerant of different loads than the M1, but it is hardly immune. It's a common practice to drill a vent hole in an M14 gas plug for use with heavy (175 grain) bullets; that shouldn't be necessary if the gas piston magically cut off the excess gas as you suggest.

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark_in_Michigan View Post
    It's a common practice to drill a vent hole in an M14 gas plug for use with heavy (175 grain) bullets; that shouldn't be necessary if the gas piston magically cut off the excess gas as you suggest.
    if you were worried about this, why not simply TURN THE SPINDLE VALVE 90 degrees to CUT OFF THE GAS completely..

    as for your personal experiences, I have found it's best to simply ignore these bits of input most of the time as there isn't much value in this opinion-based information compared to actual empirical data/evidence etc. If you have such data, that would be helpful.

    I do know that there are MANY folks have (or at least used to) shoot 175 SMKs with VERY warm loadings of slower burning powders in M1As and their only complaint was their bedding had to be re-done a good bit to deal with the recoil. None of these folks ever mentioned any gas/op-rod issues to moi.

  3. #13
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    Default loads for the m14, not the M1

    Gents,
    Thanks for all the responses. I think I've got my M14 load and that's what the initial question was about. I also have my M1 load figured out. I figure that if I want more velocity, power, and or heavier bullets I'll got to a nice heavy barreled 338 Lapua or Ultramag bolt gun. My M14 and M1s are too special to me to try and eak out the max velocities and bullet weights. They're just fun shooters and I find them accurate enough for my purposes. Madsenshooter, do you really shoot 210gr lead bullets out of your M1 or were you just making a point? Thanks again guys.

  4. #14
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    I really shoot them. They're a very hard cast alloy, 23BHN that will respond to further heat treatment. I go a lot on what parashooter says when it comes to gas volume. Just wanted to see who would jump in and say the bullet was too heavy, the powder too slow. I have an adjustable gas plug, or rather one with changeable jets, but by keeping within the parameters parashooter has posted it isn't necessary to use it.
    "I have sworn upon the Altar of God, eternity hostility upon all forms of tyranny over the minds of man." - Thomas Jefferson

  5. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by musculus View Post
    if you were worried about this, why not simply TURN THE SPINDLE VALVE 90 degrees to CUT OFF THE GAS completely..
    If you've shot an M14 in competition, you must surely know that CMP rules require that the gas system be functional and the spindle valve open. Hence the vented gas plug.

  6. #16
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    Musculus:
    I'm going to back Mark here and suggest you look in the CMP rulebook available at the CMP website as far as the gas system needing to be functional. Likewise if you knew about the common "national match" modifications done to M14's, you'd know that the spindle is locked in place (open) if one unitizes the gas cylinder. (As described in both Duff's and Kulnhausen's books)

    As far as your comment, If the AMMO IS SAFE IN ANY RIFLE, it is SAFE in an M14/M1A. That is a dangerous, blanket statement. The M14, like any semi-auto rifle is designed to operate in a range of pressure or pressure curves. If you in any sort of way get too far from that range, you will have a problem. The OP is safely somewhere in there. Your blanket statement is not. There are several books about the M14/M1A out there. The ones I have (Kulnhausen, Duff and Zediker) all talk about the reloading for the M14, you should read them.
    Last edited by BigMo; 02-19-2010 at 01:27.

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigMo View Post
    Musculus:
    I'm going to back Mark here and suggest you look in the CMP rulebook available at the CMP website as far as the gas system needing to be functional. Likewise if you knew about the common "national match" modifications done to M14's, you'd know that the spindle is locked in place (open) if one unitizes the gas cylinder. (As described in both Duff's and Kulnhausen's books)

    As far as your comment, If the AMMO IS SAFE IN ANY RIFLE, it is SAFE in an M14/M1A. That is a dangerous, blanket statement. The M14, like any semi-auto rifle is designed to operate in a range of pressure or pressure curves. If you in any sort of way get too far from that range, you will have a problem. The OP is safely somewhere in there. Your blanket statement is not. There are several books about the M14/M1A out there. The ones I have (Kulnhausen, Duff and Zediker) all talk about the reloading for the M14, you should read them.
    feel free to post the EXACT infomation that descirbes what the "correct" gas pressures are for the M14/M1a compared to the Garand. Not just generalities, or what is the "best" load, but at what EXACT gas port pressure point does one have an "excess" load despite the automatic gas cut-off. And no, I have never used an m1A in competition (although I have certainly shot enough M14s in my days).

  8. #18
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    Ok, since you have no experience with what you are trying to talk about, i'll repeat my advice to you. Get Kulnhausens book and read Zedikers chapter on reloading the M14. They will answer your questions. Just read the books.

    BTW- your friends experiences with having to redo the bedding in their rifles alot due to the battering by the "warm" 175gr loads is why they modified the gas plug like Mark mentions. If you had any experience with this type of shooting, you would have understood that.
    Last edited by BigMo; 02-19-2010 at 07:40.

  9. #19
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    "...M14/M1A..." They're not the same thing. An M14 was a battle rifle adopted for political reasons. An M1A is a commercial hunting/sporting rifle. Using handloads in an M1A voids SA Inc.'s warrantee. Neither has anything to do with an M1 Rifle gas system.
    Completely different from an M14's gas system.
    Spelling and grammar count!

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sunray View Post
    "...M14/M1A..." They're not the same thing. An M14 was a battle rifle adopted for political reasons. An M1A is a commercial hunting/sporting rifle. Using handloads in an M1A voids SA Inc.'s warrantee. Neither has anything to do with an M1 Rifle gas system.
    Completely different from an M14's gas system.
    A wee word of wisdom for you SUnray. Using handloads VOIDS VIRTUALLY EVERY COMMERCIAL GUNMAKERS' WARRANTIES!

    Sheesh, THAT we know for sure. yet, for some crazy reason, WE DO IT ANYWAY, and that is why this forum is called "the RELOADING bench."

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